On July 4, Chelene Nightingale announced her candidacy for Governor of California in the American Independent Party primary. She is an activist on the issue of stopping aliens from entering the United States illegally. Here is her webpage. If she becomes the California AIP’s nominee, she will be its first female gubernatorial candidate since 1978, when Theresa Dietrich was the AIP gubernatorial nominee.
Ballot Access News
Edited By Richard Winger
Awesome!
Hey Cody, what happened to TPW?
Let’s see how truly effective she [a military brat] can be on abused Veterans issues being a bible thumper just down the street from the world’s worst veterans home [in Barstow] where AIP ‘greats’ like Bill King have flunked and failed so badly ……
I’m wondering the same thing, NF.
I though Mr. Corey was going to allow me to continue writing for the website, yet I was wrong, apparently.
Hmmmmmm, I wonder how Mr. Robinson and Mr. Seidenberg feel about her candidacy?
Where can I find some bio on Chelene Nightingale?
First promising news out of the CA AIP in awhile. Will her campaign be dragging baggage from the predicable splits, lawsuits, and egos problems that have plagued AIP for the last few years? Her bio, BTW, is on her website.
I’m not surprised Corey has closed TPW – he got rid of the core team in the Barr campaign (including key Ron Paul operatives) so he could retain titles/controls – would it not have been for Barr’s excellent media director, he’d be an obscure footnote.
To “Citizens”
Who is BILL King? Have been with the AIP for nearly 38 years and have never run into a BILL King.
By the way, Chelene Nightingale is absolutely awesome. Her website is:
http://www.NightingaleForGovernor.com
Chelene is running for the AIP nominaton just like Democrats or Republicans run for their nomination in their respective primaries. She is not worried about the current dispute as to recognition of leadership in the party because it no way affects her candidacy. In California, the registered VOTERS–the people–ultimately control the party and who will be its candidates–not the officers–whoever they may be.
Chelene Nightingale will be a great candidate representing the Constitution Party, the American Independent Party, and far more importantly, the majority of the people of California. 2010 should be an exciting election year!
Everyone,
Let it be known, the NATIONAL VETERANS COALITION of the Constitution party, http://www.nvets.org, SUPPORTS CHELENE NIGHTINGALE FOR CALIFORNIA GOVERNOR 100% !
She is the ONLY true AMERICAN INDEPENDENT PARTY candidate for Governor worthy of support.
Chelene proudly supported CHUCK BALDWIN for President in 2008. GOD BLESS YOU CHELENE!
-Larry Breazeale, Msgt. (ret.) USAF
Nat. Chrm. National Veterans Coalition,www.nvets.org,
Kinda premature to endorse anyone before all of the candidates are known, isn’t it?
The REAL AIP; the non-corruption, non-Robinson, Seidenberg side; is ready to endorse Chelene now. Any candidate from the corrupt Robinson/Seidenberg faction will lose because of their automatic endorsement of corruption if associated with these cowards. The REAL AIP will have the greatest number of candidates for office in the history of the AIP. We will be fighting to save the nation and California but also to save the AIP, the only true conservative party in the state, from the corruption of Alan Keyes and his California lieutenants. This corruption will soon be documented at TheCorruptionOfAlanKeyes.org
Don Grundmann Vice-Chairman American Independent Party, California branch of the Constitution Party
Interesting and impressive! Does the AIP of California now have its own Sarah Palin?
The AIP (however many there are) should join with the other irrelevant parties in CA and use the initiative process to get PR adopted in some form in one or more significant venues.PR is how minor parties get to elect officials in Europe, Israel and many other parts of the world.
The target audience for the initiative and subsequent referendum would be independents, disillusioned Republicans (there must be a lot of those), and voters who believe in more competitive elections with real (instead of illusionary) choices
Chelene Nightingale is a true servant leader who loves this country and its Constitution. I know of no person with higher Character, Integrity and Faith and I am absolutely thrilled to see her running for Governor here in California with the AIP.
I cant wait to see her in a debate with Feinstein and Whitman. She will tear them up!
Reply to Gary Odem at Post # 8. Jim King is a member of the State Central Committee. He is also
the person in circa August 1, 2004 that got a Republican mole elected as an officer of the AIP,
viz., Rayna Mike-King. Then on July 20, 2007, Don Grundmann voted to remove Rayna Mike-King from her offices within AIP retroactive to August 1, 2004.
Remember Reyna Mike-King listed herself on her web
site as “Republican Businesswoman of the Year”.
Next, on January 10, 2006, Nancy then the State Chaiirperson wrote the CAL Secretary of State that
that year, viz, a date between 1 January 2006 and
10 January 2006 was the date the AIP State Central Committee “voted” to let non-party members vote under S.B. 28 in AIP primary. There was no meeting
of the State Central Committee during that period.
Bottom line do not trust Nancy as telling the truth. In 2007, I asked Gary Odom how the party
should handle that lie of Nancy to the California
Secretary of State. He has not replied to the issue of non-AIP voters voting in the AIP 2006 primary without the approval of the State Central
Committee.
I was informed on July 2nd that at the Constitution
Party gave an award to Nancy at the Newark, New Jersey meeting. It is common knowledge within the CP and AIP party leadership that Nancy is pro-Choice.
Question, why would the Constitution Party be giving
an award to Nancy, viz., William Shearer’s daughter when she is not pro-life, but is pro-choice? Is the CP leadership, just giving lip service to the ending of abortion? I know the
America’s Independent Party is 100 % pro-life.
The American Independent Party of California joined
the America’s Independent Party on June 27, 2008.
To Don Grundmann: Have you come up with the $1000
to purchase the list you order. It is work product. Also, have you come up with your suggested escrow holder?
Warning, Jim King and Don Grundmann are no officers
of the American Independent Party. They have not held an office in AIP since September 2, 2008. They are members of AIP State Central Committee.
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American Independent Party
So Mark, do you guys support Nightingale?
And FYI, Nancy is Pro-Life, I’ve talked to her personally about the issue of Abortion.
She just isn’t a psychotic extremist about it. And the same thing with me as well.
TO: Cody Quirk.
What does “psychotic extremist about it” mean in
relationship to the life of the unborn babies?
I have talked to Nancy about the issue twice. Her
views upset both of her parents. That was at the
time that Reed was Vice Chairman of AIP and she did
an attack on Reed about his prolife view. She raised the issue with me about incest and rape as
exceptions. I told her that “incest was not a crime in common law” and therefore, incest should
be a ground to murder the un-born babies. I also
told her that is she went to college an took a class in logic she would see her views were void of
logic.
The question is why the Constitution Party was honoring a person that had exceptions to a pro-
life stand and also why Nancy views are pro-abortion?
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American
Independent Party.
I just noted I left of the ? from the above.
I was asking Nancy why do you believe an unborn
baby should be murdered because of incest?
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American
Independent Party
geez, this is what I was talking about … a good candidate emerges (in spite of the AIP) and we’re off on a race to see who can go over the cliff first.
I knew Bill Shearer and I swear he should rise up out of the ground and whup the little people out of the way. I know Nancy a little too, and I’m sure to some people it would be a great use of time/talent to dice-up already split hairs. First question that comes to my mind is why investigate and debate Nancy’s reputation when she ain’t running for Gov. ?
Is someone raising money for her; does she have a campaign plan in place; are there experienced hands on board to help guide the campaign along? Does it look like she’ll offer a professional and high-energy campaign for state-wide office? I’d love to know the answers to those questions.
What does “psychotic extremist about it†mean in
relationship to the life of the unborn babies?
= In other words, shes not a a**hole on the matter like the Peroutka crowd is when it comes to Abortion. She actually has a brain about the issue and follows Howard Phillips’s advice on the subject of ‘compromises’.
I have talked to Nancy about the issue twice. Her
views upset both of her parents. That was at the
time that Reed was Vice Chairman of AIP and she did
an attack on Reed about his prolife view.
= I forget, was this when she was a teenager, or after 18? Because she didn’t get active in the AIP until she was 18, and even then, it took her some time to mature in her political views and become more active in the party, then again, it was the same thing in my case.
She raised the issue with me about incest and rape as
exceptions.
= It isn’t really ‘Pro-Choice’, in some rare and extreme cases, Abortion is necessary. And on incest and rape, in some cases it might be justified as well.
I hold the same views too, and it is not being “Pro-Choice”, rather its being logical and realistic when in comes to abortion.
I told her that “incest was not a crime in common law†and therefore, incest should
be a ground to murder the un-born babies. I also
told her that is she went to college an took a class in logic she would see her views were void of
logic.
= huh?
The question is why the Constitution Party was honoring a person that had exceptions to a pro-
life stand and also why Nancy views are pro-abortion?
= The question is, since when did we have to have our personal views in conformity with the platform? Sounds like fascism to me, and that’s what the Peroutka goons wanted too.
= BTW, in the Pro-Life plank of the CP Platform it also says-
“…No government may legalize the taking of the unalienable right to life WITHOUT JUSTIFICATION, including the life of the pre-born…”
Like I said, in some cases like a tubal prejnancy, or in a severe fetal deformity, would abortion be justified. And this part of the platform also supports that. So it really doesn’t sound like Nancy is ‘not in conformity’ with the Party.
And even if a CP member doesn’t agree with the platform, it means that he/she just can’t hold a major leadership position in the national party, or receive an endorsement or funding from the national party, either/or.
Personally, I do disagree with the national platform itself on the black-and-white language and guidelines, but I still choose to work within the CP and especially my state affiliate.
If the CP leadership doesn’t like my presence because of this, then I’d like to see them do something about it.
BTW, why are you still obsessing over a woman that is no longer involved with the AIP, or even lives in California anymore?
In fact, what are you guys doing to get the AIP more active on the political field? How are you guys promoting the Party right now?
Do you guys also support Nightingale?
Nancy Shearer is a resident of, and lives in Canada.
Her award was granted to her by the CP for the many years of dutiful effort that she put into the party both in California, and in Arizona.
The CP does not interrogate individuals on every nook and cranny of life, or every conceivable political issue before giving an award. Nancy’s work for the party was self evident. Obviously she did such in support of the CP party platform which can be found here and is quite clearly pro-life.
http://www.constitutionparty.com/party_platform.php#Sancity of Life
I do see that the Alan Keyes group is willing to support some candidates running on the Republican party line. It is well known that many Republicans in office are ambivalent to the right to life cause, and that some are downright pro-choice. Why would you ever back a candidate that runs for a party that has office holders in it that are obviously NOT Pro-Life?? Isnt this a case of the pot calling the kettle black?
Nancy Shearer is a wonderful woman, Pro-Life, and a good Christian and my friend. Nonetheless, she is irrelevant and a distraction to this particular thread.
“Is someone raising money for her; does she have a campaign plan in place; are there experienced hands on board to help guide the campaign along? Does it look like she’ll offer a professional and high-energy campaign for state-wide office? I’d love to know the answers to those questions.”
Excuse me for trying to change the subject, but whatever happened to Ms. Nightingale and her campaign for Governor? Perhaps I’m mistaken but I thought that was what this thread was about …
Peter:
Chelene Nightingale indeed does have a well thought out and written, plan, and has a several person staff working on her behalf, including those who have ran gubernatorial campaigns.
She is a professional and dignified personna, and will offer a highly visible and emergent campaign that will very likely go viral. Already her web response has been amazing, placing her site in the top 1/5th% (i.e. more hits than 98.8% of all websites in the world!)
Money is already being raised, and soon paypal will be added to her site. To contribute go to:
http://www.nightingaleforgovernor.com/pages/donate.htm
She went personally bankrupt last year. Her speech writer is also known as Bobby The Handyman.
She has no education, no job history. Her qualifications seem to be that she is 1. Not an actress 2. Can speak in public and 3. can organize an event the size of a large wedding. Her political convictions are so fluid she has gone from Bush supporter to Libertarian to Ron Paul Supporter to American Independent / Constitution party in four years.
I realize Bush was Governor of Texas with less experience, but unless Chelene has an oil rich -politically connected father we don’t know about, she is not going to make it out of the single digits. And When Gilchrist ran for congress as an American Independent / Constitution party candidate, he got 1/3 of the vote so this would be a move in the wrong direction.
BobbyDX9 is a Scientologist and uses L. Ron Hubbard’s doctrine of “fair game” on Nightingale’s critics.
And her big political ally is Jeff Schwilk, the bully of the San Diego Minutemen. There are pictures of him online posing in his girlfriends bikini that just should not be missed.
” To Don Grundmann: Have you come up with the $1000
to purchase the list you order. It is work product. Also, have you come up with your suggested escrow holder?”
Response – Mark ” Rodent ” Seidenberg : I bet you $1,000 that there were not more than 7 people at the most on the phone call where you had the fake vote to disaffiliate from the CP. You are now, as then, still a coward as you refuse to take up the bet as you know that the ” vote ” was, as you are, a fake. What a laugh that you use the term ” work product.” It was a ” corruption product.” Thankfully your corruption time is coming to a close and your lying ass will be appropriately kicked. What a disgrace to the party you and your fellow rats Noonan and Robinson are. Cowards all.
Don Grundmann Vice-Chairman American Independent Party, California branch of the Constitution Party
Why did she support Ron Paul over Chuck Baldwin?
What did she do prior to running the non profit, Save our State? What were her fundraiser goals? What was her budget? How many volunteers did she add?
Has she ever run for office?
Is she married? Does her husband support her running for office?
Sarah:
She supported both. Just like Chuck Baldwin did too!
After Ron Paul failed in his nomination attempt, Paul endorsed Chuck Baldwin. Chelene and Chuck Baldwin are well acquainted and are friends.
Sarah at post # 29. I can answer your questions. She is now single, with two children.
Her X does not support her run for governor. She was sued by Jim Gilchrist who ran for Congress under the AIP ticket. Gary Odom worked for Jim Gilchrist. He can tell you additional facts.
Grundmann at post # 28. I have never had a “bet” with Dr. Don Grundmann. I do have a work product that I made for Dr. Grundmann for the agreed price
of $1000.00 (One thousand dollars). We are waiting
for an agreed escrow holder, which as of now Grundmann has not come up with. I suggested Richard Winger, but Grundmann has not replied to that suggestion. Note the AIP does not conduct
votes by telecom.
To: Rodger at post # 27. Please tell us details of
the connection between Jeff Schwilk and Chelene Nightingale. I remember I had a nice lunch with
Mr. Schwilk and remember he was an effective leader
of the San Diego Minutemen, but I have not heard anything about him for some time. I do recall he was a political associate of Bill Lussenheide. I
also recall several telecom from Gary Odom on his
views of Mr. Schwilk and his connection with the
San Diego County Central Committee after Nancy was
sacked as San Diego County Chairman of the AIP.
I also remember Mr. Schwilk was assisting Sally
with some problem related to her great grandson
on the US Mexican Border. Have not heard the outcome of that case.
TO: Bill Lussenheide. Nancy is a Pro-Choice person. I had two conversations with her on the
subject. Both relate to a time when Reed was the
Vice Chairman of AIP. Has her views changed from
her Pro-Choice views of 2004? If so that would be
news to me. I remember her Pro-Choice views upset
both her parents.
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American Independent Party
” Grundmann at post # 28. I have never had a “bet†with Dr. Don Grundmann. I do have a work product that I made for Dr. Grundmann for the agreed price
of $1000.00 (One thousand dollars). We are waiting
for an agreed escrow holder, which as of now Grundmann has not come up with. I suggested Richard Winger, but Grundmann has not replied to that suggestion. Note the AIP does not conduct
votes by telecom.”
Response : Mark ” The Rodent ” – You don’t have a bet because you are too cowardly to accept mine which I repeat here – I say that you are a God-damned liar and that you had NO quorum for the fake phone call ” vote ” by which you claimed to disaffiliate the AIP from the CP. There were no more than 7 people at the most on that call with a Central Committee membership of 17 at the time. You cannot produce a list of more people because it does not exist and hence proves that you, Robinson, Noonan, Hoefling, and Keyes are liars. I bet $1,000 that you had no more than 7 people on that call where you VOTED in complete contradiction to your last sentence lie of above. I say that you are a complete and total coward/liar and will not accept the bet; just as you haven’t so far. What a lying bastard you are. But all of this, including your corruption, wil be documented at TheCorruptionOfAlanKeyes.org.
Don Grundmann Vice-Chairman American Independent Party, California branch of the Constitution Party
This is to Mr. Seidenberg, Dr. Gundmann and all others of both sides involved in this silly, childish dispute of who did what to who, and who actually are the legitimate leaders of the AIP.
Fellahs (and ladies) the country is falling apart! And you two bicker and call each other names like two school yard kids. Grow Up!! It sounds like you have a great patriot running for Governor who may well play a major factor in the outcome, and you are hurting that possibility by carrying on this feud.
I remember when the AIP first made ballot position back in 1968 after months of getting registrations so the late former Governor George Wallace could have ballot position for his presidential candidacy there in California in 1968.
Thanks to the hard work and shrewd political insights of the late Bill Shearer (and others) the party has withstood attempts to get it kicked off the ballot. For decades, Bill Shearer was the “watchman in the night” for this party.
And if you folks don’t end this squabbling, I’m afraid either the California Assembly will one day find just the right kind of legislation to “pull the plug” on your magnetic party name, or some other group of “independents” whom you may not agree with philosophically, is going to step in and through the democratic process outvote you and dominate who the nominees are.
It doesnt’ matter who did what to who. Get on with the business of saving this country.
WARNING: Dr. Don Grundmann is only a member of the
State Central Committee of the American Independent
Party. He has not been an officer of the AIP since
September 2, 1008. He has not been the “Vice-Chairman American Independent Party, California branch of the Constitution Party”.
Next, on his post #32 at he state Seidenberg “can
not produce a list.” The list is the work product
of Mark Seidenberg and it will be produce on the
payment of one thousand dollars by Dr. Grundmann.
Has Dr. Grundmann forgotten the terms he posted on
May 12, 2009 at 11:47 a.m., viz., “I will give
$1,000 cash to anyone who can prove that the so-called vote to disaffliate the AIP from the CP was
conducted by or had a majority of the State Central
Committee vote.” My reply was posted at 1:01 pm also on May 12, 2009.
Again Dr. Don Grundmann, please come up with the
escrow holder that I can except.
Please read the Ten Commandments and stop your vile
statements of G-d.
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American
Independent Party
I just notice a date error above. It gave the year 1008. The correct year was 2008. Therefore,
Don Grundmann has not been an officer of the AIP
since September 2, 2008.
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American
Independent Party & Executive Committeeman of the
America’s Independent Party of Fenton, Michigan the
national affiliate of the AIP.
To “An Alabama Independent” the name calling and the vile statements of G-d is coming from one side only and that is not me.
I was the elected chairman of the 2008 Convention of the American Independent Party on Saturday,
July 5, 2008. It was conducted in the California
Secretary of State Building in Sacramento. Dr. Don Grundmann was present at the convention, but
walked out of the convention, thereby giving Dr.
Alan Keyes and Dr. Wiley Drake a 100% vote for
the nomination of president and vice president.
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American
Independent Party
I waited to see if anyone on these posting would notice the error on this posting. Let’s see if
anyone can come up with the name of person that
ran for Governor in a special election that is
female. Hint I voted for her in the Special
Election when she ran against the Governator.
She is an attorney in San Diego County and ran for
President of the United States against Don Grundmann. She would make a very good governor.
Let’s see who come up with the name first.
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American
Independent Party
Mr. Seidenberg: I believe it was Diane Templin, wasn’t it?
Well, if she would make a good candidate for governor, then convince her to enter the AIP Primary against Ms. Nighingale and let the best candidate be nominated. It would give the AIP much needed media attention and regardless of whom won, such candidate would be better known by the voters of the state in the General Election.
Start acting like a real political party and settle your disputes in the primaries. That’s what the primaries were designed for.
We independents in Alabama would give anything to have a ballot-positioned party with its own primary like you have there. You folks should be thankful for that. Instead you want to name call and distract from the real issues.
All of you ought to be ashamed of yourselves.
Mark Seidenberg, for the official record.
1) My association with Jeff Schwilk has only ever been casual, with brief but friendly conversations at either Patriot or Tea Party events. We have never had any political, business, or formal relationship of any type.
2) Nancy Shearer has had profound spiritual and personal revelations in recent years. She does not apparently find the need to consistently update you personally on this on an ongoing lifetime basis.
3) Ms. Nightingale’s husband was at her side at the announcement in Campo on the 4th of July and seemed quite happy. I spoke briefly with him at the event. Ms. Nightingale, like many high profile individuals, is careful and guarded about her family and personal life. Your “intel” is incorrect, and bottom fishing.
4) Diane Templin received 1067 votes statewide in 2003 for AIP Governor of California out of a total of a total of nearly 9.5 MILLION votes cast statewide in this election. Historically, this was the lowest percentage return that any AIP Gubernatorial candidate has ever received.
5) Don Grundman by virtue of his nomination as a Senate Candidate for California AIP in 2006 holds office as an AIP State Delegate by that virtue thru 2012.
Additionally, Don Grundman was the winner of the Presidential primary for the AIP 2008, held in Feb. 2008, a true election of the people of this party in this state, in a free and open election of the AIP. He defeated both Mad Max Rieske and the above mentioned Diane Templin in that election.
Mark, why dont you consider running for AIP governor and letting us have a look at your personal history, finances, associations, and missteps and mistakes you have made in your life for all to see! As the Good Book says, “let he who is without sin, cast the first stone” 😉
” It doesnt’ matter who did what to who. Get on with the business of saving this country.”
Response : Alabama Independent – It does indeed matter ” who did what to whom.” As will be documented at the website TheCorruption OfAlanKeyes.org Mark Seidenberg, Mark Robinson, Ed Noonan, Tom Hoefling, and Alan Keyes conspired to file false papers with the California Secretary of State office claiming that the AIP had split with the CP. Their actions were a total lie and totally corrupt. Yes, the nation IS falling apart but it is doing so because of the corruption of the citizens such as Seidenberg, et. al. The AIP cannot advance when it has corrupt and lying persons such as Seidenberg et. al. claiming to be leadership. We cannot solve the problems of the nation via people such as Seidenberg et. al who are totally corrupt. Only when they are removed from the party can it advance. Indeed the reason for their actions is to cripple the AIP and make it totally ineffectual in fighting to save our nation. That is why they attacked it in the first place. They are deliberately working to destroy the AIP in order to destroy the 3rd party conservative movement in the US. This will be documented at the Keyes corruption website. It is not a ” childish dispute ” to challenge their profound corruption. No conservative political party such as the AIP can survive when its ” officers;” fakes such as Seidenberg and Robinson; are outright liars and corrupt to the bone and beyond.
Don Grundmann Vice-Chairman American Independent Party, California branch of the Constitution Party
” You folks should be thankful for that. Instead you want to name call and distract from the real issues.
All of you ought to be ashamed of yourselves.”
Response : Alabama Independent – The ” real issue ” of the AIP in California, the issue which must be addressed and resolved before the party can EVER advance in any way, is that at this current moment the people who claim to be Chairman and Vice-Chairman, Mark Robinson and Mark Seidenberg, are outright liars and utterly corrupt persons who have ” achieved ” their claimed position by the most corrupt actions and outright lying possible. They have deliberately filed false documents with the California Secretary of State office in order to claim their position; a action of outright lying and utter corruption. They have done so with the express purpose of destroying the AIP in order to destroy the Constitution Party and hence the 3rd party conservative movement in the nation. I am not ” ashamed ” that I do not compromise with evil. The AIP can only advance when it is a honorable party of truthful individuals who stand on principle. It cannot survive when its ” officers ” are outright liars who perform such actions as Seidenberg and Robinson have done. I am working to have Robinson and Seidenberg prosecuted for their corruption but one way or the other they will be stopped and removed from the AIP as it is only when their corruption is cleansed from the party that it can advance to save the nation. If we are to save the nation we CANNOT do so, now or ever, by compromising with evil and accepting its ” help ” in our battle. The nature of evil is and always will be to betray us in our battle to save the nation EVERY TIME. Just as Seidenberg and Robinson have already shown their true nature of corruption and evil they will NEVER work for the good of the nation. As I will describe at the website TheCorruptionOfAlanKeyes.org they are, because of their profound corruption, only capable, as they have so well demonstrated, of destroying. They cannot EVER build a political party because their internal nature is incapable of anything but evil and destruction. This is not ” name-calling.” I am simply stating the facts. If you were to confront such outright corruption and evil in Alabama I am sure that you would understand very quickly that such evil must be stopped and destroyed. It cannot EVER be compromised with.
Don Grundmann Vice-Chairman American Independent Party, California branch of the Constitution Party
Jeff Schwilk and Chelene are close political allies, whose primary cause seems to be attacking Jim Gilchrist.
He recently lost a libel suit and has a $135,000 judgment against him.
They share the same webmaster as Shawna Forde, who was recently arrested for murder.
Dr. Grundmann, Mr. Seidenberg (& Others):
I thought the AIP Primary was the place for settling differences with issues, opinion, leadership, and choices of nominees?
Correct me if I am mistaken, but doesn’t the AIP also elect its state executive committee in the AIP Primary? If it does, then wouldn’t the results of such in 2010 or whenever the next such Primary is held settle the matter of who is the legitimate commmittee and who are the legitimate officers?
Just because someone has a different idea of what direction the party should go or what issues should be stressed, does not necessarily mean they are “corrupt” or “evil.” Too often those labels are used against the victorious side in an election by the losers.
You all probably think I am “evil” and “corrupt” and secretly desire to “destroy the 3rd party movement” because I have suggested that in California the magnetic and neutral name of “American Independent Party” with its primary temporarily be used by Libertarians, Greens, Constitutionalists and other 3rd partisans for nominating candidates there in California.
Each of these parties should urge its activists and potential candidates to “temporarily” at least join the AIP and file as candidates for office in the AIP primary. These partisans could still be organized as factions within the AIP and which ever faction could put forth the strongest and most articulate candidate would most likely win the AIP nomination for the office sought. It could result in, for example, a Libertarian being nominated for Governor, a Constitutionalist being nominated for U.S. Senator, a Green for Attorney General and so on and so forth.
By such candidates running under the more generic and respectable “independent” label of AIP, it would enhance their candidacies and just might cause the voters to start taking them seriously. It also just might result in some political miracles with some of these candidates winning.
More importantly, it would create a unified and stronger attack on our mutual enemy – the dominating Democratic and Republican parties.
And, if the day came, when political ideology got in the way, the various factions could disband and operate within their respective party and under their respective party label again. Some, such as the Constitutionalists, might be content in remaining in the AIP. But hopefully by that time, those victorious candidates would be strong enough to win again under their own label.
But this ain’t gonna ever happen. There is (and always has been) too much “big frog in little pond” mentality in 3rd parties. There are those who would rather see their candidates lose just so they can remain the “big dog.”
Ideological purity is what keeps 3rd parties from winning. They just don’t get it. Our Founding Fathers realized that compromise HAD to be the order of the day, or else there never would have been a Constitution of the United States.
And if 3rd partisans are not willing to “compromise” on some issues and temporarily work together until they are stong enough to stand on their own, they will never make the slightest dent into the establishment of the Democratic and Republican parties.
Yes, I’m sure what I have suggested is heresy. I am secretly attempting to destroy the 3rd party movement by suggesting such a strategy. I’m sure this is what some of you are thinking.
So you folks just keep on fighting one another, and I predict that within 10 years, if not sooner, the California Assembly will find the correctly worded legislation for keeping a party from using the label “American Independent Party” as its name, and/or some other “independent” group alien to all of you, will come in and dominate your AIP primary and take the party over.
But what should I care. I’ve got enough work to do here in Alabama to get the same kind of “tunnel-visioned” folks working together to just get fair and reasonable ballot-position laws in this state.
You folks have a golden opportunity there in California. And you’re blowing it over petty squabbles. What a shame!
Yup, unlike many of the Republicrat politicians who have ruined our state & I posit, our country as well, I have a job. I work for a living & I’m extremely good at what I do. Having grown up inside the beltway, writing about politics has been my passion & if I can use those skills to get someone elected who can probably change things for the better, than I’m am glad to do it.
So many people content themselves to bitch on a keyboard instead of getting behind someone just because he/she is not their perfect candidate. Well, how well has all this bitching & back-stabbing worked at getting anyone elected for this party? You don’t like handymen, fine, forget I’m here, hate me for it, whatever but for God’s sake & that of America, do something positive or do nothing at all!
You wanna hate brunettes, cripples, Buddists, whites, cross-breeds, whatever, fine, but keep it out of politics. Can’t you briefly swallow your petty grievences for one election cycle for the good of your state, your country. If you want to sit around & bitch like bitches then go join a quilting club & leave the politics to those who are trying to accomplish something!
Thank you Bobbythehandy!
God what I’d give if there were a dozen of you in each state spelling it out like it is. I’ve been in this 3rd party business for some 40 years. It ain’t changed a bit. If someone doesn’t cross their “t’s” or dot their “i’s” just the way some self-annointed 3rd party puritist says, then such person is a phony, “evil” “corrupt” or worse.
This country may well fall. But it won’t be because of the enemy from without – but from the “bitching” enemy from within!
You have so hit the nail on the head. Continue to join me in telling these “tunnel-visioned” nabobs just the way it is!! It’s about time someone does.
God bless!
Just got on my computer and started to read these
posts. I have never filed false documents with the California Secretary. However, I am aware of several false documents filed by others with the
California Secretary of State.
One of these false documents was a letter dated
January 10, 2006, by Nancy. She stated that the
AIP State Central Committee voted that year, viz.,
some time between January 1, 2006 and January 10, 2006 to have an open primary under S.B. 28.
There was no meeting of the American Independent
Party State Central Committee that early in 2006.
Therefore, people voted in the AIP primary in 2006,
that had no legal right to. Was that an attempt on
Nancy’s part to try to distroy the AIP. I am interested in knowing other view from members of the AIP State Central Committee and how we should
deal with this problem, because it has a direct
connection to appointment to the Redistricting Commission under Prop. 11?
I was the elected chairman of the 2008 state convention of the American Independent Party held
at the California Secretary of State Building on
July 5, 2008. Bill, Don Grundmann did attend that
convention as a delegate and spoke from the floor.
He then walked out, so the other delegates voted 100% for Dr. Alan Keyes and Dr. Wiley Drake. That
is why Keyes & Drake were on the ballot in November
2008.
Both Jim King and Don Grundmann are members of the
State Central Committee of the American Independent
Party. They have not been officers in the AIP since September 2, 2008, because their terms of office as National Committeemen were two years.
They were elected at the State Central Committee
meeting on September 3, 2006 located in Sacramento
County, California. King made a big deal in 2008,
claim the 2006 meeting was void because it was not
conducted in the city limits of Sacramento. He lost on that issue in court in 2008. California Election Code only required that the State Central
Committee meet in Sacramento. It did not require
the meeting had to be conducted within the city limits of Sacramento. The limits of Sacramento County is just fine with me.
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American Independent Party. Chairman, Orange
County Central Committee of the American Independent Party. Executive Committeeman of the
America’s Independent Party (National Affliate of the American Independent Party, since June 27, 2008). [Also I am the Area Director that covers
Los Angeles County for the American Independent
Party].
When will the AIP change it’s name to “Constitution Party of California” so as to end all of this nonsense?
An additional benefit is that the name change will draw voter attention to the party’s core beliefs which will be a boon to growth.
The AIP should not be afraid to sacrifice some registered voters to have their party properly recognized.
Anyway, Go Charlene. I will be looking forward to your campaign.
Reply to Jeff Becker.
The State Central Committee of the American Independent Party had affliated with the America’s
Independent Party of Fenton, Michigan on June 27,
2008.
If Mr. Jim King and/or Dr. Don Grundmann want to
leave the AIP and form a micro party of their
chosing it is OK with me.
To your direct question, I would not vote to change
the party name. Because, I believe it would be an
insult to the Shearers. It was William Shearer wife that thought up party name in the first
place. I for one wanted to support the idea of William Shearers having the mascot for the party
as the buffalo. However, I could not get the support to do that.
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American
Independent Party.
” Correct me if I am mistaken, but doesn’t the AIP also elect its state executive committee in the AIP Primary? If it does, then wouldn’t the results of such in 2010 or whenever the next such Primary is held settle the matter of who is the legitimate commmittee and who are the legitimate officers?”
Response : Alabama Independent – AIP officers are elected at the state convention. Jim King and I were elected Chairman and Vice-Chairman at our state convention. Robinson and Seidenberg had a fake convention at which they elected themselves to the same offices and then went to court where they ” won ” by a legal technicality which ignored the fact that the AIP bylaws allow the Central Committee to call for the convention which elected King and I. We are currently suing Robinson and Seidenberg to demonstrate their corruption and legally regain our offices.
Don Grundmann Vice-Chairman American Independent Party, California branch of the Constitution Party
Jeff Becker, you must have just arrived on the political scene, my friend. And obviously you know very little of the AIP history.
When supporters of the late former Alabama Governor George Wallace chose the name “American Independent” they did so because they knew then – as most know today, that this name is reflective of the way MOST voters outside the Democratic and Republican parties feel politically. These voters were not ashamed to be “American” but more importantly they were proud to be “independent.” The name AIP was picked because it had a catchy and patriotic sound to it and it reflected the way many people felt at that time and still to today!
I had read several years ago that Governor Wallace himself objected to the then suggestion of “Conservative Party” as the name because many voters – especially labor union voters associated the “conservative” label with the GOP and it would cost him votes.
The reason that the AIP has the largest registration of any 3rd party in California is because of this generic name it wisely chose some 40 years ago. Jeff Becker says, the party should not be afraid to “sacrifice some voters?” Give me a break. “Some voters?” If the leadership changed to “Constitution Party” as Jeff Becker is suggesting, the party would lose at least 250,000 members overnight and it’s ballot position on top of it. If the AIP wants to commit suicide, then change your name to “Constitution Party” and it’s “good bye.”
This is a problem with most 3rd partisans. They are not savvy enough to understand how voters feel about affiliations. Most people in this country think of themselves politically as either “Democrat” “Republican” or “independent.” Therefore, a wise 3rd party will use a label that appeals to that body of voters they most likely can win over. And it is from those “independent” voters that a successful 3rd party will most likely win over. One doesn’t have to be a rocket scientist to understand this.
Yes, it’s true that many of those AIP registrations are voters who think they are registered “independent.” But it doesn’t matter! These people are still voters and the AIP needs them whether they are AIP, Declinced To State, or whatever.
But what the AIP needs to do rather than foolishly considering a name change, is to find additional good candidates like this Chelene Nightingale appears to be. For it is the candidates and what they say and where they stand is what will win votes. But you’ve first got to be taken seriously. You’ve first got to run under a label that will not scare the voters away. “American Independent” is an ideal label for that.
To the AIP leadership – whomever that may be – I say get all the mileage out of the “American Independent” label you can. It will definitely get you more votes than will “Libertarian” “Green” or even “Reform.”
” Just because someone has a different idea of what direction the party should go or what issues should be stressed, does not necessarily mean they are “corrupt†or “evil.†”
Response : Alabama Independent – You obviously don’t ” get it.” I will spell it out – If there had been a honest vote for the direction of the party I would have no problem with that at all. There was NO honest vote. Robinson and Seidenberg had a fake PHONE meeting of a small portion of the Central Committee of which they deliberately kept the majority of the Committee unaware of their actions. They then, with a minority vote, had a fake vote claiming that the AIP had disaffiliated from the CP and THEN they followed that up with filing fake documents with the state claiming that the disaffiliation was legal and legitimate. I will state the facts yet again – They lied. They flat out lied. I have NO problem with a HONEST vote. But they knew that they would lose a honest vote and hence they lied in order to ” win.” Do you ” get it ” now? I say that they are corrupt because they are outright liars. I say that they are evil because their entire purpose, via their master Alan Keyes, is to destroy the conservative 3rd party movement in the nation. They are fakes. Do you understand this? Can you grasp the principle of corruption?
Don Grundmann Vice-Chairman American Independent Party, California branch of the Constitution Party
” Ideological purity is what keeps 3rd parties from winning. ”
Response – The battle to save the AIP and the conservative 3rd party movement has NOTHING TO DO with ” ideological purity.” The issue is corruption. I am a former supporter of Alan Keyes. If Keyes were honest I would support him totally even if I lost a vote on party direction to those who support him. But instead I know that he, as with Seidenberg and Robinson, is a liar and a coward. I work with many different people of different views in the AIP and the CP. I DO NOT work with liars. If my side had lost a HONEST vote to the Keyes faction I would have NO problem with that. The issues are fraud and corruption. Do you understand this? At least to this moment the answer is apparently no.
Don Grundmann Vice-Chairman American Independent Party, California branch of the Constitution Party
Yes, Dr. Grundmann, I understand the principle of corruption! And yes, if there was a fake or illegally called meeting resulting in the AIP associating with the Alan Keyes group, then your law suit or additional law suits should bring out those facts and you will win. And if you can prove that all was illegal, then I certainly “get it” and will acknowledge such. And more importantly, then the rightful officers will be in charge of the AIP as it should be.
But where is your overall proof that Alan Keyes and company are out to “destroy the conservative 3rd party movement in the nation?” I’ve been reading alot over the last months about a website that is going to expose such. When is it coming? I’m open-minded and will study any facts you present. If you prove your claims are correct, I’ll take your side. But until you do, I say this is typical “sore loser” comments that usually come when one side loses out. My friend, I have been there before in my some 40 years of 3rd party experience.
But regardless of who is right and who is wrong, you folks should nominate the best and strongest candidates for office there in 2010 – even if they are not your personal choice. We have too much to lose in this country to play “childish games.”
The website will be ready shortly. Only my lack of technical expertise is currently delaying it.
Don Grundmann Vice-Chairman American Independent Party, California branch of the Constitution Party
Don Grundmann is way off base. After all these years he and Jim King had no idea how the officers
of the party are selected.
First the State Central Committee controls the American Independent Party. The organizational
meeting of the State Central Committee gets it
officers by way of the by-law and California Election Codes section 7640 (for the Chairman)
and section 7641 (for the other officers).
Second the perminate officers referred to in Election Code section 7577 are the officer of the
day meeting at the convention. I was the elected
Chairman of the 2008 convention. Don Grundmann
was at that convention on July 5, 2008. I was
conducting the convention as the Convention Chairman because I was elected under Election Code
section 7577.
However, the following day, viz., July 6, 2008, I
was reelected to an additional to year term as Vice
Chairman of the American Independent Party by the
State There are far more members of the State Central Commit
My computer is acting up and posted to early. There I will continue below.
-tee than delegates to the convetion. It is good
to know that a event that took place in Los Angeles
that both Grundmann and King call a convention of delegates had an a so called “election of officers
of the American Independent Party.” What a couple
of screw up, King and Grundmann are, they held a
bogus election of state party offices with the wrong body in the wrong location.
Don, thank you for spilling the beans, viz., the
King and Grundmann election was conducted in what
you call a convention (bogus) and not at at a bogus state central committee meeting. I only counted three delegates entering that room in the
hotel by LAX on June 28, 2008. Then a week later July 5, 2008) you showed up at the American Independent Party Convention as a delegate and spoke from the floor.
This posting will be very useful. I plan to share
it with several state election official.
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American Independent Party.
Dr. Grundmann and Mr. Seidenberg:
Without having been there and being more familiar with your election statutes, I have to reserve judgement as to what happened at your meeting/conventions ref the requirements of election statute.
Still, I wish Dr. Grundmann would lay it out here on BALLOT ACCESS NEWS for all the world to see ref his claim that certain ones are are attempting to “destroy the conservative 3rd party movement in the nation.”
I have been seriously considering giving assistance in organizing a state affiliate of the “America’s Independent Party” in Alabama. But I don’t want to associate with anyone that might not have the same objectives that I do.
The reason I have not actively supported the “Constitution Party” is its name. It is not a marketable name. Most voters outside the Democratic and Republican parties do not politically consider themselves as “Constitutionalists” although they may support the Constitution. They do consider themselves as “Independents” and when the “America’s Independent Party” was organized, although I thought it’s full name construed oddly, still the useage of the name “Independent” appealed to me. In my opinion, the only 3rd party that will ever be successful in this nation is the one which uses the word or name “Independent” as/or in the name will succeed.
So I would like to know just what Dr. Grundmann has to say that might discourage me from associating with the “America’s Independent Party.”
Here’s your chance, Dr. Grundmann.
Here’s your chance Mr. Seidenberg to prove him wrong.
Don Grundmann states that “We are currently suing …Seidenberg to demonstrate…corruption and
legally gain our offices”
This is news to me. In what court am I being sued
and the case number of that lawsuit.
Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American Indendent
Party.
TO Alabama Independent.
A good location to organize is in an around the campus of Auburn University. I stayed there several times over the years, because of programs
at the Mises Institute. If I had the time I would
move to Alabama and help you organize.
Note that Chapter 2 of the Part covering the California Election Code deals with the business
of the American Independent Party Conventions.
Also note Chapter 3 of that Part deals with the
State Central Committee.
It was Ann E. Thomas (the non-Member Secretary of
AIP that called to order her bogus Convention sua
sponte). Yet the real AIP convention time and
location was set by the State Central Committee and
called to order by the State Chairman of the Party
who was elected for a two year term on September 3,
2006.
What Thomas, King, and Grundmann did reminded me of
tactics of the College Republicans from the 1960’s
where a small faction which did not have the votes
announce the “REAL” group is meeting in a different
room down the hall. Then do a walk out to the new
room and claim to be the “REAL” College Republicans.
It did not work with the Republicans then and will not work with the AIP now. Remember Jim King planted his wife,
Rayna Mike-King as a Republican Mole and Grundmann vote to remover her from office on July 20th 2007
retroactive to August 1, 2004. Rayna Mike-King
posted on her website she was the Republican Business Woman of the Year.
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American
Independent Party.
P.S. How would you deal with the false reporting
done by Nancy, daughter of Wm Shearer, on January
10, 2006, that the State Central Committee met between January 1, 2006 and January 10, 2006, an
voted to allow the decline to state a party affliation voters access to AIP Primary when there
was no such meeting?
” So I would like to know just what Dr. Grundmann has to say that might discourage me from associating with the “America’s Independent Party.â€
Here’s your chance, Dr. Grundmann.”
Response ; Alabama Independent – The website TheCorruptionOfAlanKeyes.org will document that ” America’s Independent Party,” the party of Alan Keyes, was founded upon the total corruption of Keyes and his lieutenants inclusive of Seidenberg, et. al. The text is completed and it is only a matter of my putting up the site.
” Don Grundmann states that “We are currently suing …Seidenberg to demonstrate…corruption and
legally gain our officesâ€
This is news to me. In what court am I being sued
and the case number of that lawsuit.”
Response – The current status of the lawsuit is that Mark Robinson is in hiding to avoid papers being served upon him. A typical cowardly action for Robinson. He will be tracked down and you will learn of the lawsuit soon enough.
Don Grundmann Vice-Chairman American Independent Party, California branch of the Constitution Party
Reply to Post # 60
What kind of lawsuit is it? Is it a secret lawsuit? This is the United States it is not the
Soviet Union yet. Why will Don Grundmann no tell the reads about the lawsuit and the website on the corruption of Alan Keyes? Could it be just hot air on Dr. Don Grundmann part, because the AIP
State Central Committee would not back Dr. Don Grundmann for President of the United States in 2008?
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American Independent Party.
Mr. Seidenberg:
First of all, how did a non-member get on the Central Committee in the first place? Do you have people there who think because the “AIP” is a 3rd party that the statutes don’t apply? I’ve dealt with people like this before.
Sounds like if this does go to Court, and one group can’t prove their legitimacy over the other, the Court may well order a new Convention/Central Committee meeting to settle the issue. That could be the best thing to happen. You folks have got to get this behind you so the party can move forward.
As far as my opinion about allowing the “declined to state” voters to vote in the AIP Primary, I think this is a wise move on the part of the AIP even though you allude as to whether this was done properly by AIP officials.
Just as we both know there are AIP registrants who think they have registered “independent,” likewise, there are hundreds of thousands of those who are registered as “declined to state” who hold political views expoused by the official AIP. Why should you not encourage them to vote in the AIP primary?
You want the AIP to grow and win more votes in the General Election? Then get voters into the habit of voting in the AIP Primary and this habit over time will extent into the General Election. Both the Democrats and Republicans benefit from this also.
As I’ve already pointed out in prior comments. 3rd parties that are too ideological lose. The Founding Fathers had to compromise to get the Constitution of the United States ratified, and the AIP and other 3rd parties are going to have to compromise on some issues to win elections.
Thanks for the offer to help organize an AIP in Alabama. My oldest son and daughter-in-law both graduated from Auburn.
While I appreciate Alabama Independent, Bobbythehandy, and the few others who are politically practical, logical, and effective, please don’t fall any further into the AIP abyss. The CA situation is hopeless. The reference above to Big Frog-Little Pond doesn’t even apply here. Thanks to squabbles of silly little people, the pond has long dried up. Let them keep/argue over grand titles – they look like prissy Admirals of the Swiss navy. Let the hissy fits continue — these people are irrelevant to real life. If there are any politically talented and motivated people in CA who are sincerely interested in providing a robust alternative 3rd party option, stay away from the AIP. Too bad the AIP, with its fine legacy associated with that name is lost, but its only a name. It is time to move on.
I am quite amazed that Mr. Seidenberg would continue to show his smarmy face in public.
I first met Mr. Seidenberg at a logistics meeting in Sacramento, hosted by several GOP activists, dedicated to destroying any and all 3rd party operations.
I found Mr. Seidenberg to be of little veracity. He claims to defend our Constitution, yet he has in the past expressed opposition to Proposition 8. He’s a confirmed bachelor who always seems to travel in the company on one or two young boys.
I have never seen Mr. Seidenberg in the company of a female, only young boys.
When someone calls him a “Rodent”…They are doing a dis-service to 9 out of 10 fine and upstanding Rodents.
To The Alabama Independent and ALL others,
Be advised, Mr. Seidenberg, Robinson and the very few ‘others’, who unfortunately hold VERY TEMPORARY positions in the California AIP, are all “birds of a feather”…”legends in their own minds”.They live in that “gray twilight” or, “alternate universe”, far far away, that knows neither right from wrong . They are completely irreverent.
Gary Odom and myself (and others I have no room here to mention) have been registered in the AIP since 1974. WE HAVE SEEN IT ALL. The KKK and the NAZIS tried to take over our party numerous times, to try and take advantage of a political party to further their own fringe agenda. It did NOT work.
WE showed them the door.
OTHER “fringe” groups , along with the ‘power elite’ tried to destroy the AIP.
It is nothing new this time. THEY forget who they are dealing with here in California. There are plenty of “AIP LOYALISTS” firmly connected to the national CONSTITUTION PARTY (like we have had for many years) that are “wise” to all the LIES and HATEFUL TACTICS of ” A FEW MISFIT OPPORTUNISTS”, who certainly do NOT have the AIP or CP’s best interests in mind.
“WE” will certainly stand up to these opportunists at every turn. “WE”, the real pioneers of this AIP, who have been involved with the party for years…decent, law abiding citizens, concerned for the future of our country, refuse to see all our efforts go up in smoke by a ‘few bandits’, with completely no class. THEY are a complete embarrassment to the American Independent Party and the thousands of Aiper’s registered in California.
TIME IS ON OUR SIDE. “THEY” will lose, just like all the ‘others’ lost. They will lose in the courts or voted out in 2010. Either way…good riddance! If anybody wants to really know about serious AIP candidates, who really care about the AIP in California and shares solidarity with the mother party..CONSTITUTION PARTY…contact BILL LUSSENHEIDE at http://www.aipcalif.blogspot.com
– Larry Breazeale, Msgt. (ret.) USAF
Nat. Chrm. National Veterans Coalition,
http://www.nvets.org,
I think some people should do some investigation into “bill Lussenheide
constitution candidate for congress Ca.
He is the biggest liar fake and cheat.
He lies to the IRS, and was accused of
inappropriate behavior with his children. He is a religious zealot
and psychopath.
So I lied about having a current radio talk show. It was an infomercial. lol
I will say anything to get the attention
of sheeple. Sheep will listen to anyone.
All I know about Lussenheide is that he refuses to split a ham sandwich with me…What kind of good God fearing Christian would refuse to eat the White Man’s Swine?
All:
I never post under pseudonymns as was done in post 66.
I did not post the above, post #67. Richard, if you could remove this, I would appreciate it.
Lussenheide is one of the biggest windbags in the Constitution Party. Full of himself and yet doesnt know squat dididly. A mediocre and desperate person.
Typical religious kook, probably wants to have some kind of “Theocracy” here in America. I find him,in person,to be somewhat mentally stunted, and very simple, with a huge messianic complex of some kind.
Agreed Hunt. A real loser-heide! Biggest Ass**** I have ever met, and a real mental midget.
” I first met Mr. Seidenberg at a logistics meeting in Sacramento, hosted by several GOP activists, dedicated to destroying any and all 3rd party operations.”
Response : Mr. Rockwell – I would greatly appreciate it if you can contact me regarding the meeting which you refer to above. I have received reports from multiple sources regarding the actions of Mark Seidenberg in being a Republican ” mole ” within the AIP who while feigning support for it has actually been working since his first moments in the party to destroy it. Hence I would appreciate learning your account of the event. My office number is 510-8956789. Thank you for your aid.
Don Grundmann Vice-Chairman American Independent Party, California branch of the Constitution Party
T. Hunt & Tom Ellison – Bill Lussenheide has more integrity and intelligence in one finger than you morons can ever imagine much less have. You are both my reminder this day of the wonderful blessings that the Creator has given me in that ” There, but for the grace of God, go I.” If I ever get discouraged about anything I will automatically cheer up knowing how bad things would really be if I were a idiot like you 2.
Don Grundmann Vice-Chairman American Independent Party, California branch of the Constitution Party
Bill Lussenheide should be forthcoming with his educational background and
religious leanings. I read plenty about his alliance with a Religious Cult
on the web. He seems mentally unstable
and possibly dangerous. A powder keg ready to blow.
J. Walker – Why don’t you tell the truth about YOUR ” religious cult?” Your commentary reveals you as a obvious cult member in addition to clearly illustrating both your mental instability and your profoundly inferior educational background; i.e.; you are stupid. I pray for your ” Damascus Road,” i.e.; lighting bolt to the head; conversion and salvation. It is, as with T. Hunt and Tom Ellison above, your only hope of achieving sanity.
Don Grundmann Vice-Chairman American Independent Party, California branch of the Constitution Party
Birds of a feather “flock” together.
See how far you go backing a psychopath.
People will pull away from the party when “unstable” people push themselves
to the front. Hidden agenda’s. Key word. Look for their hidden agenda’s.
May God bless you and guide you on this journey.
If I were working for either or both of the 2 major parties I would want to make sure that no 3rd party had a chance to destroy my monopoly. The way I’d go about that is by making sure the party was mired in process. I’d bring lawsuits & muddy the political waters so that people couldn’t even tell who is running. If I could make the name of the party so convoluted that it would be hard to understand exactly who or what the party stood for, then that would be a crowning achievement.
In short, I’d do what is going on, on this very blog. You people need only read this disgusting dirge of insurrmountable process, “corrections” and self-rightous diatribes to see why this gang will never get anyone elected. Any AIP candidate who succeeds will do so in spite of, not because of, the belicose, bloviating blowhards, who have so obviously infiltrated this party in order to destroy it. Read over this page for yourselves and you will easily spot who is here to get candidates elected and who is here to sanctimoniously, with feigned authority aggressively prevent anyone from getting anything done.
On other blogs, such people are called “trolls”. Trolls are cretins who want nothing more than to argue with people and cause trouble. When they are not being removed, the sane bloggers are admonished, “Please don’t feed the trolls”. This means ignore them, don’t feed their hateful nattering. Ignore them.
These long-winded tirades that say nothing more than, “Stop and do something else or nothing at all”, are merely red herrings that y’all get involved in chasing. Those of us who want to win had better get a positive additude here and get energized. Leave the greasy lawyerese to the plants and eventually their their verbal masterbation will cease to disrupt our party.
The Nightingale express is barreling through this party on it’s way to Sacramento so y’all better climb on board or get off the tracks or we’ll run your ass over!
If you will nominate Chelene, you will regret it.
Don, I think some of these party critics here are the anti-religious kooks that bashed the CP in the TPW forums.
Party Critics? If you fail to “vet”
people who run under the Party name,
you are setting yourselves up for ridicule. How many people hide behind
the Christian faith to gain trust?
Do these so called candidates “actions
match their words?” ie: Lussenheide for Congress. I saw him speak at Camp
Vigilance, he appears to want to use the constitution platform for his own
self acknowledgement. “None are so blind as those who will not see.” What exactly does he want to DO FOR the people? Does he really want to be in Congress, or does he just want a platform to self “aggrandize”. These are pertinent questions. Why waste time
and endorsements for someone that uses
the party? I hope all will take harder looks at the people that want to represent this party. Just because someone talks louder doesn’t make them
right. take care
I’ve never seen political party members who were so obsessed with trashing their own members & candidates. I’m reminded of lizards that eat their young.
This guy is not one of us. But probably with that Libertarian Humanist crowd that was badmouthing Chuck Baldwin and the CP last year.
I’ve noticed, with great laughter, that Siedenberg’s posse, would rather make up lies about Bill Lussenheide, than refute my allegations of Siedenberg’s latent homosexuality? Hmmmm….Interesting.
I’ve long been amazed at how many, such as Siedenberg, Robinson and Noonan rail against homosexuals publically, whilst cavorting with little boys privately.
Siedenberg’s entire life, reminds me of the late Hank Greenspun’s famous “Where I Stand” column from the 50’s where he exposed Joe McCarthy for being a bone smoking homo…As he put it, McCarthy is the “Queer who made Millwaukee Famous”
Tell me Mr. Siedenberg…are you friends with former Congressman Mark Foley?
Blinded by the light?
Don’t kill the messenger.
J Hunt:
I’m overly underwhelmed by the pure unadulterated codswallop you spew on this and other sites…
what? lol Freedom to think beyond the
box is what the Constitution Party is
all about, am I wrong? If someone doesn’t approve of a candidate hook, line and sinker they are to be ostracized by the party? To be able to use rational analysis of a candidate
is/should be what being Free in America
is all about. I am not spewing hate, just an opinion. Differing views keeps
debate alive, which keeps us from becoming a “socialist” society. You can vote for whomever you wish and defend as well, but, I will not follow
someone blindly. Candidates need to be
upfront with ALL information as to background and qualifications for position. Prentending to be something
you are not is fraud. have a nice day.
*pretending (add to above)
After reading the comments above, I think many of the questions posed by
bloggers are relevant. We should not
blindly follow anyone who trys to impress us with double speak. careful
vetting of candidates seems like a viable thing to do.
BTW are chelene nightingale and Bill
Lussenheide running under the (AIP) that would be recognized on the ballot?
Or will they be “write in” candidates for “The Constitution Party?” Does Mr.
Seidenberg recognize them as viable AIP
candidates? I am confused.
patriot1…Clearly, you’re either totally ignorant of the Elections Code in California, or your last post is a set up for Monsewer Seidenberg?
California is a “Closed Primary State”, as such, Monsewer Seidenberg legally doesn’t have ANY authority to limit or expand who can and cannot run for the nomination of the AIP.
Nightingale is free to enter an AIP primary, as long as she meets specific qualifcations as laid out in the EC.
Much to Monsewer Seidenberg and Ayatollah Markup Robinson’s chagrine is the fact that under state law, there is no “Litmus Test” for potential nominees.
Whoever wins the most votes on the AIP line will be the nominee of the AIP.
What Monsewer Seidenberg needs to do, is to curtail his procivity to engage in political masturbation, and start learning how to count…Seems Nightingale’s forces already know that…
Reply to Larry Breazeale at Post # 65
I thought you would find this of interest. On October 19, 2009, in the case of King v. Robinson,
Judge Power will conduct a OSC hearing on why the
Brewtown lawyer of James King should not be fined
for failing to file a Case Management Statment (CM-110) on or before July 6, 2009.
Also, under S.B. 28, it is Chairman Robinson that
gives notice to the California Secretary of State
of the vote of the AIP State Central Committee on
who can sign for Ms. Nightingale. Chairman Robinson has not yet received a reply from Ms.
Nightingale on who she wants to sign for her. viz,
open to decline to state voters or just AIP voters.
In a letter dated January 10, 2006, Chairman Nancy
wrote the California Secretary of State that the
State Central Committee voted between January 1 and
January 10, 2006 to have an open primary. However,
that was disinformation, since their was no meeting
of the AIP State Central Committee during that window.
Warning, Dr. Don Grundmann is a member of the AIP
State Central Committee, but has held no office in
the party since September 2, 2008. Grundmann was
also removed as an Area Director by past Chairman
Noonan.
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American
Independent Party.
Reply to Seidenberg Post#92…..
ANYTHING and EVERYTHING “YOU” say is pure “B.S.” as usual. You and your ‘few cronies’ don’t matter anymore.
TIME IS ON ‘OUR’ SIDE and ‘your side’ is surrounded by the ‘good guys’…..”US” ! ATTRITION, the COURTS and the just SHEER NUMBERS of Pro-Constitution Party and AIP loyalists-statewide candidates WILL LEAVE YOU “FEW” IN THE DUST, to weep on each others shoulders. THEN, the American Independent Party will rightfully be back with its rightful caretakers and BACK firmly with its national party affiliate , the Constitution party( The way it has been for several years and, the way it should be, and WILL BE.) You all are wearing the ‘black hats’, as per usual, while “we” are wearing the ‘white hats’.The AIP has a great group of’ Pro-Constitution Party’ American Independent statewide candidates! CHELENE NIGHTINGALE is an outstanding candidate for Governor.You few are NOT the least bit interested in helping to build the AIP in California. “WE” are and, so much in fact, we will make your heads swim!SOON, the AIP Leadership will be BACK in very capable good hands. I, for one can hardly wait!
Oh, is your bags packed yet???
Larry Breazeale, Msgt.(ret.) USAF
Deputy Sheriff retired,
Nat. Chrm. National Veterans Coalition
http://www.nvets.org,
reistered AIP since 1972
Did John Wayne just enter the room?
🙂
Reply to Post # 93 of Larry Breazeale.
First, the State Central Committee of the American
Independent Party affliated with the America’s Independent Party of Fenton, Michigan on June 27,
2008.
I take it you want the AIP to affliate with the
Constitution Party. I disagree, I believe the
America’s Independent Party is doing a good job
as a national affliate.
I did ask for your view on what you think should
be done about the January 10, 2006 letter to the
California Secretary of State by Chairman Nancy,
viz., stating that the State Central Committee of
AIP voted to take part in S. B. 28, when the State
Central Committee did not meet during the time
period, so it could not have voted.
Please give me you view on how you think we should
deal with that disinformation?
Next, the Brewtown lawyer of Jim King will have to
attend a hearing on October 19th over being fined
in the nature of an OSC for not filing a CM-110.
That is no BS.
I take it you are backing Nightingale. All I know
about Nightingale is what I read in the Gilcrest
lawsuit against her. Let me know why you think
Nightingale should be backed by AIP. I have changed my views in the past.
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American
Independent Party.
Hello all,
I am Davi Rodrigues. I am a former member of SaveOur State.org from February 2005 through May of 2009, at which time I was banished from the organization during one of Chelene Nightingale’s jealousy rooted, paranoia driven episodes that have become very well known in her previous affiliations circles. Prior to that, I had always been an exemplary member with no blemishes on record, and a faithful activist within the organization. Having been in the management end of SaveOurState for some time, I worked with Chelene closely, and managed the forum and group activities in her absence. I would like to offer my opinions on the party’s selection of this candidate. I do not believe Chelene is a good step for the party, primarily because despite her public speaking abilities and personable characteristics, she has no credible qualifications for the office of Governor. With that said, if the party chooses her, it will not be taken seriously in any elections in the near future. This is your credibility you are putting on the line, and if you have researched Chelene’s history, you’ll be running the most ridiculous choice for the highest executive position in the state. If you haven’t researched her history, why would a voter ever trust any candidate the party chooses in the future?
Chelene has no executive experience, no proven record of working with other elected representatives, no financial savvy, and very little in the way of educational background in politics, constitutional law, or California codes.
I know you all wish to believe that her high spirited speeches and activist background is worthy of investing in, especially when considering what Californians have been forced to deal with from the current two party system. However, If you look closely at her past you’ll see she has made as many enemies as friends, the organization she managed lost most of its’ members during her reign, and since she took over, the org has essentially been rowing in circles around her ego. This is precisely where the party will be headed should you continue down this Nightingale course. I am a believer in the third party option, but I cannot and will not cast a vote or tender a donation for such a whimsical candidate. Neither will I take any party seriously that chooses their candidates so carelessly.
To; Davi Rodrigues
At post # 96 AvatollahGondola Posted your statement
on BAN. You stated you were “Banished” during a
….”episode” that was well known in Nighingale’s
“privious affilation circles”.
This is all news to me. I am the Vice Chairman of
the American Independent Party, I heard Ms. Nightingale give a speech on July 2, 2009 in Los
Angeles and received here home address from Charles
Deemer a former officer on the State Central Committee of the American Independent Party.
There is some disinfornation posted that the American Independent Party has asked Nightingale to run for Governor. In the AIP only the State
Central Committee can ask some one to run for
State Office. The State Central Committee could
delegate that authority to an Executive Committee.
However, AIP currently has no Executive Committee.
The AIP did not ask Ms. Nightingale to run for Governor.
Therefor Davi, my suggestion is post the details
of your asseverations.
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American
Independent Party & Executive Committeeman, America’s Independent Party of Fenton, Michigan
(which has been the National Affliate of the American Independent Party since June 27, 2008).
P.S. The Constitution Party is not affliated with
the American Independent Party.
I personally know Chelene Nightingale as a great patriot activist, good mother and deeply devoted to her Christian faith. She firmly stands by the platform of the American Independent Party (aka: Constitution party, at the national level).
She is widely known in the “anti-illegal immigration” circles. Yes, she has some enemies, like everyone else in high profile causes. I figure I have enemies too. (“They” can ALL just get in line, for all I care.)
I am very proud of Chelene for having the courage to step up to the plate and announce her candidacy to run for Governor, at the urging of many AIP loyalist-activists, along with myself.
MANY other AIP statewide candidates are stepping up to the plate as well, all up and down the golden state. “THESE NEW AIP CANDIDATES” are NOT ‘goose-stepping’ to the ‘soon-to-be-out-of-a-job’political opportunists (YOU ALL KNOW WHO YOU ARE)and taking some ridiculas ‘loyalty oath’ , to a few bumbling buffoons on a ‘power trip’.
ANYONE CAN RUN FOR OFFICE ON THE AIP AND THROW THEIR HAT IN THE RING, FOR THE CALIFORNIA PRIMARY.
They do not need ANY PERMISSION from the “three stooges”. If they have been in the AIP for at least a year, they are good to go.
It is called the ‘political process’. Dah!
The AIP STATE LEADERSHIP is a TEMPORARY position.
The buffoons at the helm now (un-fortunately)…
will be eventually soon ousted during the normal process or, from the ‘courts’….which ever comes first.
There are a number of republican friendly “NEOCONS”(masquerading as AIP State Officials) that will try to spread more lies about Chelene Nightingale and any AIP or Constitution party activists associated with her and her campaign. Many ‘anti-illegal immigration’ activists, Minutemen, TEA PARTY activists, and military veterans and concerned Americans ,are wise to these ‘dirty trick ‘tactics.They know that CHELENE is the REAL DEAL.
She will be a real ‘shot in the arm’ for the AIP/CP.
Just what we need. She is very knowledgable of the issues, especially on illegal immigration, the border, the federal reserve, pro-life , etc.
CHELENE is a real gem! A real savy campaigner!
It will be a real honor to work in her campaign.
Keep the pressure on Chelene! The ‘opposition’ is running scared! Defensor Fortis!
-Larry Breazeale, Msgt. (ret.) USAF
Nat. Chrm. National Veterans
Coalition, http://www.nvets.org,
Constitution party,
registered AIP since 1972
Davi feels he got yelled at & like any little nancy wet his pants & cries about it. Grow a pair Davi. You & Snidenslug can peddle your crap to those who are interested in such things. Larry, I hope we meet in the near future. I wish everyone in this dung-slinging party had the style, class & intelligence of you & Bill L. Let’s flush this crap!
Reply to Larry Breazeale at post 98. I was at the
meeting on July 2, 2009 in Los Angeles that Chelene gave a speech at the request of Elliott Graham who is a member of the Los Angeles County
Central Committee. She speaks very well. However, I have no clue what she believes. She
did not write “no exceptions” on the loyaly oath
that Mr. Charles Deemer administer to her. Both
you and your wife wrote “no exections” to the loyalty oath that Charles Deemer gave you both. Charles Deemer gave me Chelene home address which
I passed on to Chairman Markham Robinson.
I still need your view of how the AIP should deal
with the January 10, 2006 letter that Chairperson
Nancy wrote the California Secratary of State. It
stated that the State Central Committee met between January 1 and January 10, 2006 and voted
to be governed by S.B. 28. That is outright disinformation The State Central Committee did not
met at any time during that time period.
Larry, I thought the AIP sacked Rayna Mike King in
July 2007. She was a registered Republican in Los Angeles County who list on her website that she was
a “Republican Businesswoman of the Year”. Then Chairman Ed Noonan asked me to get the records from Dean Logan on Rayna Mike King. Is the another Republican the State Central Committee needs to look at?
The State Central Committee of American Independent Party affiliated with the
America’s Independent Party on June 27, 2008. I
thought I told you that on July 28, 2008 in Los Angeles.
Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American Independent Party and Executive Committeeman, America’s Independent Party
oath that Charles Deemer
You against a different opinion here bobby? I would be also if I were you and had such an incompetent, bumbling fool of a candidate to support. Silencing the truth is the hallmark strategy of Chelene Nightingale, and it surprises me not that her core propaganda minister has adopted it also. It won’t work very long though. Not in the league she has entered. The people that control politics in America are more adept and treacherous than a few illegal immigrants and their support network. They will expose her in short order regardless of her speaking abilities and shallow soft soaping charm, because you can’t dress up the foolishness and ignorance that will flow forth when she opens her mouth in public before intelligent people. And when that happens, they will laugh at her, you, and the party who told the voters that this was the best they could get.
The whole thing reminds me of high school kids running for class president
etc… Some of these people never got
elected to anything in school, so now
want to be acknowledged in middle age.
Stunted growth. I suppose it is harmless, after they lose accordingly
they will justify their loss. And the whole process starts all over. Very strange indeed. peace
Children who have only the balls or intelligence for name-calling.
“# bobbythehandy Says:
July 30th, 2009 at 6:52 pm
Children who have only the balls or intelligence for name-calling.”
Which you evidence on nearly every forum or blog you sully.
This is the real world Bobby, not the delusional musings of a failed science fiction author and inventor of Scientology. Don’t you have an auditing session to attend?
Seidenberg:
Are you still associated with and/or taking your orders from Pat Nolen?
Patriot:
Is your EMeter broken?
Are you attempting to cross the bridge, before becoming clear?
you’ll never make OT, being the reactive asshole you are here.
How many lies can Mark Seidenberg spread?
Read the truth HERE:
http://thecorruptionofalankeyes.blogspot.com/
Let me ask this:
What do you expect to accomplish with Chelene Nightingales campaign? She’s bizarrely pro-Christian in a state overrun with agnostics. Thus far she has been unable to seperate her religion from politics, so how can you square that with strict constitutionalists within the independent demographic.
To the AIP (whomever that actually may be),
There are those of us who have been in politics for a while who hope and pray for the day of the third party to come very soon.
Your choice of this woman, to say nothing of your conduct as a group in forums such as this, send us running back to the two parties that have ruined this State and this Country.
Those of us who know Chelene have absolutely NO DOUBT that you have not spent five minutes vetting your candidate. Her “career” and resulting resume is a fraud. Her only paid job in the past five years is as one of those people who hand out cheese in a supermarket.
She ruined Save Our State, taking the enrollment from over 2000 down to about 20 actual participating members. This woman is one of the most jealous, petty, and deceitful people I have ever worked with.
It would seem that she has impressed your party’s founder, which is no surprise. That wide eyed enthusiasic grand daughter routine is how she sucked all of us in. But, as soon as someone upstages her you will see the manic personality that she has become known for.
Chelene is a fame seeking ego maniac with absolutely NO accomplishments to speak of. She pretends to be a patriot, but has done nothing but take credit for other’s work. She pretends to be a Christian for credibility’s sake. This woman is not a Christian. She is a hateful, childish, and ignorant person which would matter little to most of us who have stayed busy doing the work she takes credit for except that now she has somehow convinced you that she is worthy.
Simply put, whatever microscopic support we might have gotten for the third party movement and all of the work of Chuck Baldwin and patriots like him, is being spent on a silly errant little woman who has never helped anyone including herself. This would be truly funny if it were not so sad.
Why did Chelene announce that she is the AIP’s candidate before the AIP has had their primary? Is she lying again or does she not know how it works?
If Joe Turner cannot win a race for Clerk in San Bernadino, or for a seat on their School Board, how is Chelene intending to turn her claims over his work into a serious bid for statewide office?
Everybody knows that Save Our State has fallen apart under Chelene and that despite the many unanswered pleas from Mr. Turner, on their forum, for “someone” to take the helm even after Chelene had already announced her new position as the group’s leader, that she was the only person who wanted the job. And once she got it, she disappeared for four months because she became homeless and was living on the couch of Michael Williams.
Michael Williams, btw is the co-founder of the group Border Hawks. This is the group who’s leader and lieutenants were just arrested for murder in a home invasion robbery. Michael Williams, himself a convicted fellon for burglary and possession of stolen property, is Chelene’s webmaster, friend, and #2 in charge for a while at SOS. Shawna Forde (SOS Member BorderHawk) and Michael Williams (SOS Member AZPatriot), with the help of Chelene (SOS Member PatrioticDream), were the creators of a scam to solicit donations for Forde’s daughter who according to the three of them was kidnapped by the Russian Mob. All of this turned out to be a fraud, of course, but now Chelene is running around pretending that she never knew these people. They WERE the organization she is claiming to have run!
So, I don’t know if this is incompetence or deceit, but it is at least one or the other and surely disquallifies Chelene from running for town dog catcher much less Governor.
Oh and where is Mr. Turner’s endorsement? Or March for America’s (put on the Ron Paul event that Chelene takes credit for), or Ted Hayes’, or Ramos & Compean’s?
Ask Chelene how much money she has ever raised for any cause. She will answer by taking credit for somebody else’s work.
Does the AIP know what vetting is? Should we respect a party who does not even know how to Google their candidate’s name? Spend the $45 and run a background check before you ruin what slim chance our 3rd party movement has.
I always wondered if the AIP was TRYING to lose elections. Now I know.
The AIP isn’t trying to lose elections. They are trying to force people back into the the Dems or the Repubs. Running a foolish little girl like Chelene as a candidate for Governor is meant to take away another option in the same manner the powerful people who manage politics in California use the Dems or the Repub candidates who are either far right of far left; Limit your choices to bad, worse, or ridiculous.